Troll With Bacon and French Horn

We start with a real question hiding inside a joke: what anxiety looks like when you’re good at covering it up. Then we wander through photos, music, engineering, bad gadget design, and the strange ways our parents’ lives quietly steer our careers. 
• Podcast anxiety versus baseline life anxiety 
• Describing tree-ring images and lichen wall art as forest design 
• Acoustic treatment ideas and turning decor into function 
• Macro photography versus photomicrographs and choosing lenses under weight limits 
• Arctic tundra textures, color, and making prints you can swap out 
• The career question: who we’d be without our parents’ jobs 
• Growing up around community music, sound booths, and engineering projects 
• Why microwaves and touchscreen cars have terrible user interfaces 
• Choosing ecosystems and land over medicine and money 
• PCC breakfast sandwiches, free samples, and the Fremont troll detour 
• Big-picture idea of salvaged wood and local wood economies 

Transcript

Anxiety And Low Stakes

Scott/Ben 0:02

Anxiety. You have anxiety? What? Who? Well, we were I thought all of us. I didn't think you heard that.

Eric 0:12

No, he's the most relaxed guy ever, right?

Scott/Ben 0:15

No, right. Be careful. Anxiety, and you didn't know it. Gotta be careful what you speak into the computer. No, no, but no, but it's fair that you didn't know it because they did a pretty good job at covering it up.

Eric 0:27

Yeah. But yeah, you gotta look. Yeah, and when there's that look, the worried look in his eyes sometimes. It's like, you know. Oh, yeah, that sounds like my dad, right?

Ben 0:38

We're talking specifically about podcast anxiety, uh just baseline, just the anxiety.

Scott/Ben 0:44

No, the podcast does not make me anxious at all. There's no stakes. Okay. So it's just life in general. No, the only stakes in the podcast is my relationship with you. I don't care about anything.

Ben 0:57

That doesn't matter.

Scott 1:04

That's a good question.

Ben 1:09

Welcome. Hi, Eric. Hi, Ben. Good to see you.

Eric 1:15

It's been a long time.

Ben 1:16

It has, hasn't it?

Eric 1:18

Your mom showed me. No, wait, was it Adam that had the photo? Or is it Ben? The the cross section of the tree rings.

Scott 1:28

Oh yeah, that would be confusing, wouldn't it? Adam was more the ring guy. Yeah, okay.

Eric 1:35

Okay, okay. So I mean I'd got the tree part of it, right?

Ben 1:38

Yeah, exactly.

Eric 1:39

Which aspect of the ring is forest. He sees the trees before the ring. Yeah, exactly.

Ben 1:49

Yeah, more the the the on the forest scale, whereas the Adam is on the vascular structure scale.

Eric 1:59

Anyway, if you didn't see it, it was a very cool photo.

Ben 2:02

Yeah, no, I have seen it. Is this is this the one of his recent recent uh model uh simulation?

Scott 2:10

Yeah, he sent that to me. It's really shaved down and it's got a lot of weird large vascular things, like and and it looks like it looks like little gems and jewels. Like he popped whatever frozen in there.

Eric 2:25

It looks like there's like like liquid copper and nickel and whatever. It's just crazy looking.

Ben 2:32

Yeah, he sent that picture to me the other day. For the listener who doesn't haven't driven it beautifully. And uh Do you have listeners?

Lichen Art And Studio Acoustics

Scott 2:45

His model I don't think there's too many. I think I get like uh oh yeah, I don't reveal numbers. Get pictures of what it's going to hell, Scott. Yeah, we started we were talking on the podcast because I am quite can you describe this then moss?

Ben 3:12

I'm gonna describe it as a I would describe it. Photo of right photo green moss. Well that three-dimensional I didn't know that okay, right multiple hues of neon green lichen forest theme. Okay, it's one of those it's one of those things that you see at boutique y restaurants where people put together all the preserved lichen. It's like a neon. This was my Christmas present from Adam, asymmetrically placed so that you get the vibe of like a forest.

Eric 3:53

I assumed it was like an acoustical room absorber that was ecologically sound.

Ben 3:59

Oh, that's cool. Why do I know? Just get that. That'd be a really good sound.

Eric 4:03

So we can put one. We need uh how many of these do we need three dozen of those, and then you get the room will become more like a a voiceover studio.

Scott 4:15

Yeah, exactly. I think Adam's got it. Adam and I should go into a business selling this. I'm you would actually make money at that. I I mean you would. And you can be the you can be the design consultant, Ben, because it's your inspiration.

Eric 4:27

Just get it placed on like Rick Beato's podcast, and and you'll have a million people ordering it, you know.

Ben 4:33

Exactly. Yeah, that's that's maybe that's who we're sponsoring today. Our sponsor, who we're sponsoring, the lines are blurry these days. It could also, if you put that all up in the walls, it could also be like uh the eco eco-sych ward.

Scott 4:56

What do you mean by that? Even without ego psychward, if you go into this orange painted room with with with dead, maybe it's moss. I'm not sure it's really actually lichen.

Ben 5:09

I feel I think it might be real lichen that they probably dip in some sort of preservative, or just maybe they just dry out.

Eric 5:18

Having been, when I was like 10 years old, a train model train geek. This looks like the the lichens that you use for little model train things, you know. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Bushes and trees and whatever.

Ben 5:33

What what was that supposed to do signify putting lichen in the model trains? The model trains just moving forest products around.

Scott 5:44

It would look like a tree. Yeah, it would be scale.

Ben 5:47

Oh, I see. So they would go on to the little model trees, not in the trains. For some reason, I imagined you putting them in the trains.

Eric 6:02

Same, same concept.

Arctic Tundra Photos And Macro Lenses

Ben 6:04

Yeah. I yeah, I loved those things.

Eric 6:07

I actually I just printed some pretty large, like two by three foot, like four or five prints that I took up in Nunavut, which is used to be called Northern Territories. And it's Arctic Tundra, and it it looks like that only there's like all these colors. There's everything from like white to you know, light greens, dark greens, there's red fringes on stuff, and there's berries here and there, and it's just crazy looking.

Ben 6:36

Photos of the tundra?

Eric 6:38

Yeah, yeah. I took some like macro photos, and I just I took them like two or three years ago, and I've always wanted to do something with them, and then I I just printed them, and then in it, we have this long hallway, and I put up a rail, like a picture hanging rail thing, you know. Yeah, little extruded aluminum jobby, and you put these clips on it, and then you can hang. So it's like the art of the day, you know, and I don't want to be tied down to just one picture that we put on the wall for 25 years. I want to be able to swap it out with whatever I like. That's yeah.

Ben 7:15

Macro photo. So, as in like, does I'm always getting confused about this? People say I got a macro lens, and that means you can turn what's micro into macro. Seems backwards to me. So are you taking close-up photos?

Eric 7:29

Or like oh, you're asking a very uh uh definition-oriented question here. Because we talked to us when I asked Laura about the photo that Adam made. Is it a micrograph photo micrograph or is it a macro photo? Yeah, I think the only difference is if you're shooting it through a microscope, then it's a photo micrograph. If you're the macro lens just means a lens that is able to focus more closely than a traditional lens.

Scott 7:57

And a microscope is a collection of macro lens. Yeah, isn't yeah.

Ben 8:02

Well, yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, they're kind of doing the same thing, aren't they?

Eric 8:06

Yeah, yeah. But in my definition is yeah, that it's when you when you when you when the I think the real definition is when you approach like one to one, where the size of the object is the same as the size of the sensor through that lens, you know, so it's like one to one. Like a piece of glass. Well, just I don't know, it's just magnifyers.

Ben 8:27

The size of the object is the same size as your camera.

Eric 8:30

Yeah, I think it's probably just an empty tin panel. You know, and there you go. I don't know.

Ben 8:39

Yeah, yeah.

Eric 8:41

It was so on this trip, we we were very limited on weight because the only way to get into there, the site we were at, was by small planes. And so yeah, this 50-pound limit. I mean, I've got 50 pounds of just lenses I could bring, you know, but I had to bring clothes too. So I I narrowed it down to one or two lenses, and and this one was mostly a telephoto, 100 to 500, which I thought there'd be wildlife and stuff to see, which there was a little, but it also focuses reasonably close, but with a long focal length, so it's effectively like a a macro that way. So wow, took some really nice jobs, so I was happy with it.

Ben 9:21

That was a very resourceful, resourceful choice with a friends I can call and you had to choose only three things to go to the Arctic Tundra with nobody mentioned AI until now.

Eric 9:34

But I I remember your dad's joke from god how many years ago, you know, I don't need any artificial intelligence, I just rely on my natural stupidity, you know. My joke. That was your joke, right? I still use it today. No credit for either, except now. Well, yeah, because you had to.

Scott 10:06

I thought of a good question. Which fantastic two or three of us could answer.

Eric 10:15

Okay, are we in series now on this? Yeah.

Scott 10:17

Why did we start recording it?

Ben 10:19

What if we would if just one of us answered it?

Scott 10:24

You can you can make up your own version of this question, Ben. Then I'll ask it just doesn't apply to you in the same way. But what career would you have chosen, do you think, if your dad wasn't an electrical engineer? I mean, what would you have inherently found on your own if your dad didn't say he? That's a good question.

Eric 10:46

Actually, yeah. Okay, so I'll go. Or a computer science, computer verse. So uh my uh my dad, he had uh eighth-grade education from Sweden before he came to the US. And then so that's uh 12th grade education for the US. Well, no, he never finished high school, but then went on to but he was in Sweden, so he was five, six. He dropped out. I mean, you know, because he had to support the family, they were didn't have any money, and he did a delivery job on bicycle, believe it or not, but you know, a three-wheeled big uh cargo bike. And and then I don't know the exact circumstances we didn't talk about that much, but he ended up leaving, you know, his stepmother and and came to the US with some other relatives, provided the the bond. He had they had to sign a bond for to do that. So he came over as a sax player in a dance band, and so that was his his real love was music. And forgot that he was self-taught, had never had a music lesson in his life, but was in a pretty reasonable jazz band, you know, the traditional Tommy Dorsey and all that, you know, the four saxes, and and and that's where he met my mom, who was also a musician, she was a trumpet player, and so yeah, so she she was working at the music store when he came in and what music store Brander's Music in Duluth and Brander's music, yeah, Bill Brander, and so you know, she had her eye on him, and somehow they all met. And and ultimately she worked at the University of Minnesota and enough to pay for their room and board, so she put him through school, five-year engineering program, and that with that music store salary.

Ben 12:43

That's yeah. She worked at a music here the U of M.

Eric 12:49

No, no, the the music they met at the music store. She worked there because it was in town where her dad was the band director at Denfeld High School in Duluth.

Scott 12:56

Oh, really?

Eric 12:57

Yeah, he was German. He was off the boat. He's actually an illegal alien.

Scott 13:01

I'm sure he was really into like free jazz.

Eric 13:04

Chief Jerry. You know, so he he jumped ship in Boston Harbor, met my grandma, you know, who became my grandma, and and and and you know, married her in order to get his uh legal status.

Scott 13:18

So you almost love you almost in.

Eric 13:22

Right. So, you know, growing up, my parents were in all sorts of community, you know, they were in the civic orchestra, they were in you know, community bands, my dad was in jazz bands and all that, and he was an engineer, but their real love was definitely music, which the reason I'm here, by the way, is because I'm recording your dad's band, right? And how did I get started on that? Well, in the summers, when I was, I don't know, 12, 13, 14, maybe up to 16, they would be in community theater. And dad and mom would play in the pit band, and then my dad would fill in here and there, you know, bass clarinet, Barry Sachs, and once in a while, and then he would set up and do front of house sound. And eventually, then I since I was there with nothing to do, he's like, Well, here you were on this, I have to go play, you know. And then we started recording them and all this. So I was I've been doing this for more than half a while.

Scott 14:17

You see, I didn't I didn't really hear or understand all this like back when we lived together, you know, in college because I was like more like an electrical engineer's son. Right. It's like I like probably asked more questions about your dad's you know, career than than musicianship. You were you were the musician. Yeah, you and Laura were the like, oh, you guys played played instruments. You're playing I was singing here. I was just a play quiet.

Ben 14:50

Didn't you play trumpet at some point?

Scott 14:52

I took music theory, yeah. I played trumpet. I I had a lot of things going. I was very music interested, but I didn't think of myself as a but not, it wasn't kind of ingrained in you in the same way. I never played a song on stage with an instrument. I'd never done that.

Eric 15:07

I remember my piano recitals being scared shitless at like six, seven years old at McPhail on the stage.

Ben 15:15

I remember that.

Eric 15:16

Wow, okay.

Scott 15:17

I had stage trumpet recites. You had prints about the same time, and and you went one way and prints went another way. Yes.

Eric 15:26

I mean, so I know it sounds like you're rambling, but no, that's so the answer to your question 20 minutes ago is my I probably would have ended up as a musician. Yeah. I I I was a brass player, so I played trumpet first because mom did. Then one of her friends said, Well, you know, he's he he should be a French horn player because that's harder, and blah blah blah. You know, so I did. I played French horn. I was in the All-State Orchestra, and we played at Orchestra Hall. And okay. I even I even had students, and I was a terrible music teacher, but I had some students like our freshman year for maybe a quarter until the parents realized I was also not a good teacher. And I didn't, my heart wasn't in it at that point either. I you know, yeah, I I loved it because French horn is not a jazz instrument, and I love jazz. And I did play sax actually after what year was that? After I got out of school, we were you didn't play. Yeah, we were at that house on St. Paul, and then when I was when I moved in with Rain before after, I had a I had a tenor sax for a while.

Speaker 16:34

Yeah, tenor sax, yeah.

Ben 16:37

So parents were musicians. So instead of instead of the parents being farmers and saying, here Eric, drive the tractor. I I'm busy, they said, Here, operate the sound booth. I'm busy. And so you could have gone two directions. You could have been a farmer, or you could have gone and worked for John Deere, and you just work for John Deere.

Scott 17:03

I see. I see your analogy.

Eric 17:04

I'm following it, I think. And we did we did have the those kind of. I I do remember my parents telling me, like, look, you know, we know you love music and all, but that's a great advocation, but you know, do something that'll give you a good job.

Ben 17:20

Yeah.

Eric 17:21

And I did, I loved it. When I was growing up, my the entire basement of the house was like playland machine shop on one side, electrical shop on the other side. And so that's how I'd spend my time, is I had projects. I and what's funny is like they were oftentimes music related. I I built my own metronome, it was one of my first projects, right? And then I I used it, and then I was I actually tried to write an article. I submitted a draft article to popular electronics on how to build it. And it they said, you know, nice idea, but I was like 14, 15. Wow. And you know, so then they are like, Yeah, you know, try it again, uh, you know, some other time, whatever.

Scott 18:05

But yeah, you built your own prodigious bicycle odometer. Right, right. When we when we biked from back from California, Eric, you know, there wasn't bicycle odometers, didn't exist as a product. So he got the chip and the little that made the little magic. Engineered it himself. Engineered it, and yeah, or was it just a speedometer? Well, it had to be an odometer. No, I don't remember.

Eric 18:31

I I just remember it had a display. You had a display, an L C D display, numbers that user interface. Wow. I mean, that was pretty awesome for the time, right? It was that reminds me that it was about it was about three inches by five inches.

Scott 18:47

It was a little brick. Yeah, it was it was big.

Ben 18:51

Before the product even existed, you made sure that the user interface was user-friendly. That reminds me that when mom and dad, when you were renovating the house, mom was picking out different appliances, and you you were a consultant of sorts, and I remember her reading off an email that you had sent her about different microwaves. Wow. How you enjoyed certain microwaves, but you hated their user interface. And so that's very important background.

Why Bad Interfaces Make Us Mad

Eric 19:25

You know, I mean, so here's my pet. It's all about user interface and and features that I want or don't want, right? So we it we just moved into a like a new house now, builders, and they chose everything. And you know, I'm slowly replacing all of it, but like so the microwave. I want to turn on it, and it is also the fan, and it's it does a terrible job of it. But to turn on the fan, you press this button. I can't read it, the font is so small, so you have to just know where the buttons are, and it starts out at speed six, and you got to press it five, four, three, two, one. So you see a million button presses. And if you go too far, it wraps around, it starts again. It's like, oh, you're pressing this button like a crazed monkey, like and and then and then if I want to change like the power, I have to go to a sub-menu. Oh, I hate the sub-menu.

Ben 20:17

You know, and it's like yeah, changing the power. I've never found a user interface with a microwave where changing the power is straightforward. With every new place I move into, with every new microwave I use, I have to spend about 12 minutes troubleshooting.

Eric 20:32

Right. You gotta look up the so good thing you have a bachelor's degree. I found a commercial microwave box, right? It was a you know ugly metal box, but it had a knob with for a timer, a knob for power, and a go button. Boom. Oh, that is so great, right? It's just like you put your shit in the microwave, set the time, set the power, boom, and you walk away and done. No menu, right? I loved it.

Scott 21:00

Did you really need to kiss the new trending cars to go back to new knobs for anything? Everything I so much want temperature control better now.

Eric 21:09

Right. You know, so and now I've got this big touch screen and you're driving, and I I can't do this, right? Whereas in the old car, you could just reach and you knew exactly where the knobs were. You could adjust the radio, yeah, the temperature.

Ben 21:24

That's the real reason why accidents are getting worse. It's not because people are texting, it's because you put a freaking computer screen in front of me.

Scott 21:31

Right.

Ben 21:33

Oh, it doesn't play YouTube when you're driving, but sorry, because I'm not about to watch The Ovan right now.

Eric 21:42

I need a YouTube video to show me how to drive.

Ben 21:48

What am I supposed to be doing again? Well, this is great because one of my questions, Dad, was how how this was mostly directed at Eric, but two out of three people could. Have answered it of the how did you become a tech wiz? And I think you answered you asked it in a much more personable way.

Scott 22:07

I I'm well he's it's Eric's like thinking, you know, about being a musician. I'm going like, well, would I say that? If my dad wasn't an electrical engineer, would I become a musician? I'm thinking, like, probably not. I probably would have. I did software in rebellion to my dad's electrical engineering, kind of. Oh, wow. I mean, just talk about it, right? Like, no, that's so old. It's philosophical. I believe the trial and error. Well it came from the design correctly, and of course, verify, but everything's designed correctly first. And I was going like, no, nothing's perfect. I'm just gonna build it, see if it works. That was my rebellion. So there's part of me that really likes software. I wish I made money at it. My wife just called texting and kick. Made a mistake going into software. There's no money in there. I'm glad your wife doesn't make you like call her right now. Yeah. So why did you what what would you have done then? Did you not answer that? Yeah, I think I would have. Well I was trying to. I think software was a big thing. And I wish I'd been more into music, but I'm okay. I was into music all the way along because never had a show before.

Ben 23:34

I mean, I think it's pretty normal to be into an art form and then not do it professionally, you know. It's kind of pretty typical.

Scott 23:42

Well, I kept it going. I kept learning skills at the art forums I wanted to. It just, you know, not as much if you're retired. Well, that was a great question. Thanks. Thanks, Scott, for coming up with that.

Ben 24:01

And uh, thanks for coming. Thanks for coming on to the podcast today. Really appreciate it.

Scott 24:09

What about you, Banner? What are you rebelling against your father for? He's ridiculous. This is how he started his comedy career is making fun of me. That's true.

Ben 24:28

That's true.

Eric 24:29

I mean, for every comedian, the parents are a rich source of material, right?

Ben 24:32

I mean, what would I have done if my father was not a software engineer? Yeah, why would you be out counting?

Eric 24:42

What if he was a deadhead bass player or something? Yeah.

Scott 24:49

Never mind. Deadheaded Jason.

Ben 24:54

Yeah. Yeah, you're not quite squarely in that.

Scott 24:57

No, I'm playing hate streets.

Ben 24:59

Which is why the question's relevant. Because what would we have done if you were a deadhead bass player? Yeah, you might be a computer scientist if I would have been. Honestly, yeah. If you were a deadhead, I probably would have gone into software. That's probably yeah. But instead, I repelled and chose something with no money in it because my parents had money, I guess.

Scott 25:28

Yeah, don't count on too much, right? You might get a cabin in Wisconsin.

Speaker 25:32

I mean, you know, I see I see Laura's mom at 96 looking good. So it's like, you know, you're gonna be waiting a long ass time in.

Choosing Ecosystems Over Medicine

Ben 25:42

Maybe I'll be able to supply my own lumber, and that'll that'll be my benefit. I feel like the really big question is what I would have done if mom wasn't a doctor. It's like, really? Because that's kind of what I was thinking about for a while. That was kind of the inspiration through a lot of my, I think, high school sort of academia sort of centered sort of med high school education.

Scott 26:08

Yeah.

Ben 26:09

I was like, well, you know, I get good enough grades, and then you just go, and then you get a you you can go to med school, you know, you just learn how to work hard enough, just like my mama, and then you'll find yourself doing something. And then I just got got to some point. I don't know if I was burnt out on it. Who knows what happened. But I was just like, that doesn't really nah. I don't I don't really want to do that, actually.

Scott 26:33

Do you remember when you came to that realization?

Ben 26:36

Or I don't think it was all that abrupt. I don't I think it was well. What I what I always returned to is my first semester in college, where but I was already starting to lean more towards non-human bio, yeah. Inhuman bio if it wasn't in human bio, yeah. If it wasn't, there's money in that. Oh, yeah.

Scott 27:04

What that well, you like the human exercise part.

Ben 27:09

I like the human exercise part a lot, yeah. But at some point I became less interested in doing that as a career, right? And I think that transition just happened at some point in college where I became much more interested in ecosystems and lands, and that just that became endlessly more fascinating to me. Yeah, um, I do wonder though, what what how life would have been if I stuck to the more human bio or kinesiology side of things. I do wonder. But such is life, you know. I don't know if it was a particularly like I don't, I was just I feel like I was really just going off of vibes the whole time. And I'm just like this, I wasn't thinking about like where the money would be necessarily. I think I was thinking more about that, honestly, maybe not all that consciously early in high school. Thinking like, oh, I want to be a nutritionist or I want to be a sports medicine doctor, and I just like a really clear sort of idea there of what to do. But that yeah, and then as time went on, I just kind of just like oh I'm just gonna go into farming. Money doesn't matter. Yeah.

Scott 28:26

And now you're like, now you're gonna here I am. You're finding uh well, you gotta work with people with money, otherwise you're just outside the economy.

PCC Breakfast Biscuits And Free Samples

Ben 28:37

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I yeah, yeah. Let's talk about something different. Uh I what's who's our sponsor? I have an idea. I should just I should I should just go uh unless we have a fight of the sponsors right now, battle of the sponsors. No, no, no, okay.

Scott 29:02

I got one I'm not gonna name because it's not a full-on sponsor, it's one we can make fun of. So we're gonna if you got a full-on sponsor.

Ben 29:11

This full-on sponsor sponsored my morning. Okay, I went to Pacific Community Markets down the road in uh Fremont neighborhood of Seattle, and I like to go there for their breakfast biscuits. It's the cheapest breakfast sandwich you can find on this side of the the cut. Say the name of the place again, Pacific Community Markets, PCC is how people typically know this is right on near the water, right?

Scott 29:49

Yeah, yeah, really close.

Eric 29:51

I was just down there last night, right?

Scott 29:55

He's in Seattle. Oh, I missed I'm mixing up the sun again. Yeah, yeah.

Ben 30:00

You were just down by the water though, you know. Same down, right? Yeah, it is kind of connected.

Scott 30:10

I'm setting the timer right now to know that we have nine minutes left. Oh, we're on the free zoom.

Ben 30:15

That's the timer.

Scott 30:16

Well, the weird thing with this time to zoom is they take away the clock right at the last minute.

Ben 30:23

Right, right.

Scott 30:23

So you just can't Yeah, you just say you have one minute left. And then so, but I got I got it.

Ben 30:30

This is when I need it, okay?

Scott 30:31

Yeah.

Ben 30:32

Oh, is that right?

Scott 30:32

Yeah, it's good.

Eric 30:34

Right there, so you're just wrapping up like and so and then click you get cut off, right?

Scott 30:40

I guess, yeah, it doesn't help if I have it on my iPhone.

Ben 30:44

Zoom, if you're listening, this is well you can't you can count it down for me while I talk.

Scott 30:49

But they had the best breakfast sandwich.

Ben 30:52

Sorry, they have well the the best, most cost effective. So I really like those breakfast sandwiches.

Eric 30:58

Egg, bacon, bacon, cheese, cheese, and are there ash browns too? No, or the carbohydrate is the the carbohydrate is the biscuit.

Ben 31:09

Okay, and the biscuits are great. They're I think scallion cheddar biscuits. Yeah, buttery, yeah, they're good. And did you sometimes you get in there and they're all gone? I think they're both shot. And so today I went in there and there were two left, and they were ham, ham, cheese biscuits. And I was just like, I know, like I guess I could do this, but I just don't really like I've tried to do that a couple of times when the ham or the turkey ones are the only ones available, and I usually regret it. There's just something about the bacon one. There's something about it, it's bacon.

Eric 31:48

Still from the same angle, just yeah, and then and then.

Ben 31:53

And so this is the first time I went to the deli counter and was like, Do you have any more bacon back there? You know? And they're like, Let me check for you. They were like so excited that someone in the actually like, yeah, I am here, aren't I? Like, let me go check. And so he went back there, and then he came back. He was like, You're being prepared right now, but what kind did you want? I'll see if I can get one for you. And so I told, I want the bacon. He's like, got it. And so he went back there. A different person emerges holding a sandwich and a Sharpie, and she's holding them both up. I'm like, okay, this is interesting. She's like, I have the sandwich for you, but here's the thing. And I'm like, oh, okay, there are instructions involved here. Got it, cool. She's like, going to give this to you as a sample. Because I didn't actually, I didn't realize, well, it looks like it has a barcode, you could just give it to me. And she's but she's like, no, I'm gonna give it to you for free. And the church, I think she just seemed so elated that it's like, wow, she had never been on the sales floor before. It's like, thank you for bringing me out here, Ben. Like, what's your name? She's like, I'm Trisha. And I'm like, are you the one that makes these? Because I love them, they're great. She's like, every day, Tuesdays and Wednesdays.

Eric 33:20

I think she's good on you. Um the storm before. I and the Sherpey was to write her. I don't think I've seen her before.

Ben 33:30

But now, like, I'm thinking, wait, so does that mean I have to do this every time there aren't bacons available? I just maybe I just walk back there and Trisha and you don't want to do this. Trisha, where my well, dad, she's like, I don't know, she's there's there's quite an age gap. Yeah, she's a beautiful woman, don't get me wrong. Okay. Okay.

Scott 33:51

I don't I don't have and I don't need to space for that in my class. Do you take it down and sit with the troll and eat it?

Ben 33:59

I went outside and ate it.

Scott 34:02

Journaled a little bit. Troll's like a block away, isn't it? I was looking at the map of your neighborhood.

Seattle Trolls And Local Wood Ideas

Ben 34:08

Yeah, the I walked by the troll. I walked by the troll twice this morning. Have you heard of this? I walked by the troll about four times a day.

Scott 34:14

Neighborhood in Seattle, where there's a bridge uh over the water from Lake Union flows into the Puget Sound. And so they need bridges over that part of the city. And so under one of these bridges is a statue of a troll.

Ben 34:30

It's a big he's a big troll. He's a big troll. And then right next to him is Troll Mall. It's a little community garden, a wind winding path up the hill. It's it's adorable, it's great. I love being able to walk by it. We we have a cool place, it's interesting because it's it kind of was like a really big artist epicenter, and now it's heavily town, it's a hippie town and there you there's still inklings of it, you know, like the Lenin statue, Vladimir Lenin is stands like 25 feet tall, just like in the middle of the neighborhood somewhere.

Eric 35:05

Are these are these trolls made out of wood?

Ben 35:08

Oh no, this is like he almost looks like he's made out of sandstone.

Eric 35:12

I imagine that's we have in this park in in Raleigh area where near uh me is Dorothy Adicks Park. And there are these trolls like similar size, maybe not 25 feet tall, but at least 15 feet tall, and they're made out of you know, re materials found nearby. It's it's a lot of slabs of wood, you know, wood. It's it's made of trees, your favorite thing. And and so they're outside and they're they're quite large. Um, and you can follow this path and go see all these various trolls. And we did that around Thanksgiving. And they're they're not just in North Carolina, they're uh all over the US. Uh this artist, I don't remember the name of the artist, does stuff, but pretty cool.

Ben 36:00

That's inspiring. I feel like the the the troll under this bridge needs a friend.

Scott 36:06

You gotta you should yeah, erect one and put it down as a little bit of a well. I can't make one of those, and now I just document it on our podcast.

Ben 36:14

My dad was not an electrical engineer, so I don't know how to build things.

Eric 36:18

You could be the bank sea of trolls, you know.

Scott 36:22

Out of wood, out of wood, because wood's your stuff, right?

Ben 36:25

Yeah, yeah. Locally salvage wood. You know, literally when I was at PCC, I was writing down because I have like I keep returning to this idea of like somehow invigorating local wood economies and like using salvaged wood from urban areas. So maybe this is a good, you know, more functional well there.

Scott 36:50

That that decompose the problem is you have to manage the decoup decomposition because I don't, you know.

Eric 36:56

Well, that's that's why we live in a village, and there are some people that well, it's wood, you just set it on fire, and then you need to there you go.

Scott 37:05

Yeah, just start fire. Year long, or you put up a statue for a year and then you burn it.

Eric 37:11

Burning man.

Ben 37:12

Wow, it's burning man. We just burning man. Okay. I bet someone's already tried that.

Eric 37:18

Well, it used to be you know, burning troll, but yeah.

Ben 37:22

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Be clear that this is yeah, although I don't know if that's kind of the message I want to go for. Let's burn the magical mythical creature.

Scott 37:33

Burning troll, yeah. That's kind of like the burning troll podcast, you know. But you can't hate anybody in the fantasy world, you know. Hate vampires have equal rights. I who said this?

Ben 37:49

I just said I like trolls. Anyway, I'm pro-troll. I don't know if I ever finished the sponsor. Thanks, Trisha. Okay, a long sponsorship.

Scott 38:00

Okay, wow. So now we have to play the music here, and then I gotta play the music again in a minute. Do whatever makes sense. Yeah, yeah, okay. People have to keep working. We have a keyboard. The guy doesn't the post-production button inserts these musical. Oh, your post-production team. Yeah, it's to help people when they're fast forwarding through the commercial and they want to know it's done. Right. The music look for the music.

Ben 38:27

Yeah, because yeah, people don't want to listen to me talk about people don't want to listen to us talk about trolls and PCC.

Scott 38:33

And then we use the devious approach of talking about other things in the middle of a sponsorship.

Ben 38:40

Closing closing thoughts.

Scott 38:41

Yeah, closing thoughts.

Ben 38:43

Good to see you, Eric. Good to see you. Thanks for being here. Thanks for all this recording for my.

Scott 38:49

Yeah, it'll be fun. Yeah, we'll send you a copy.

Ben 38:52

Looking forward to hearing it.

Scott 38:54

Me too. What what'd you say, Dad? I'm looking forward to hearing it too.

Ben 38:59

Yeah, good. Yeah. All right. Okay. Have a funny day. Bye, man. Bye. Eat some bacon for me.